Siol nan Gaidheal forum

From Traquair, in the North British Person on Sunday:

The Brit Nats are not going to like this, one of there own and arguably the most vociferous journalist opponent of Scottish Nationalism The Telegraph's Alan Cochrane has this to say on the matter of Lockerbie.

"Lockerbie bomber: Blame Megrahi's release on London, not Edinburgh"

"For perhaps the first time ever, I find myself on the same side of an argument as Scotland’s Nationalist administration."

"it increasingly appears as if Prime Minister Brown and Foreign Secretary David Miliband are content to allow the SNP administration to take the flak over this issue as part of a greater game to help secure British and American access to the Libyan oil and gas fields"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/alancochrane/6073739/Lockerbie-bomber-Blame-Megrahis-release-on-London-not-Edinburgh.html;

So yet again the British no doubt as poodles to the Americans are cozying up to an admitted sponsor of terrorism and murderer in the shape of the devil incarnate Gadaffi himself, yet no wails of disgust and horror from most Brit Nats. If Megrahi's, and there is an if, is guilty then Gadaffi is ultimately the one responsible with equal or even more guilt yet Blair and Brown prostrate themselves before him in yet another sad imperialistic game to further their own selfish interests never mind any moral outrage. Kenny MacAskill's conscience is clear as he did what he thought was right & fair and even ultra-Brit Nats like Alan Cochrane recognize it, whereas the likes of Brown & Blair are cavorting with a murderer and are lacking of any conscience.

And to add insult to injury to our Brit Nat comrades Alan sums up as follows :

"Slowly but surely, the two countries are drifting apart. Devolution was supposed to save our 300-year-old Union. It is actually doing precisely the opposite. "

Read it and weep.

"A Scot is to blame. But it's not Alex Salmond"

"Getting Alex Salmond to take the flak for paying the price for the restoration of diplomatic and business links between Britain and Libya has been a masterpiece of New Labour spin."

"Above all, the visual record of Tony Blair’s repeated smiling visits to Gaddafi’s tent headquarters in the desert should be seared on the retinas of all those who are critical of dealing with the Libyan dictator."

"Britain even agreed to sell arms to the same regime which had smuggled weapons to
the IRA!"

"If Afghanistan had oil rather than opium, perhaps the Taliban could come up smelling of roses too"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/columnists/article-1208405/MARK-ALMOND-A-Scot-blame-But-Alex-Salmond.html

Just more cynical politics from terminally ill British empire whilst they do deals with devil in the form admitted terrorist sponsor and murder by proxy Gadaffi.

Scotland has the high moral ground here whilst as per form the British play in the gutter and cess-pool of international affairs. Their hypocrisy stinks to high heaven.

Meanwhile I see that former 'Scottish' Labour Leader Henry McLeish also seeks to hold a higher moral ground rather than rolling in the mud so amply demonstrated by the likes of Gray.

"Henry McLeish said Megrahi ought now to be released on compassionate grounds"

http://www.sundayherald.com/news/heraldnews/display.var.2525752.0.holyrood_set_to_back_calls_for_lockerbie_public_inquiry.php

Evidently Gray can pronounce on what his decision would have been without having even read a small portion of the evidence. Then again Gray may have a point he would have just rubber stamped whatever his London masters had ordained so no real need to bother with such niceties as studying the evidence and deciding on the right decision. I guess being ruled by England does have its advantages for those of the Labour persuasion as they would have no need to actually exercise their brain, again perhaps also not a bad thing :)

Additionally McLeish and the Scottish Parliament are likely to back a call for a full public inquiry. I wonder if the Brit Nats will move as fast on that has they on full public inquiry in the illegal Iraq War. It would appear there is indeed much to hide here.

http://www.sundayherald.com/news/heraldnews/display.var.2525752.0.holyrood_set_to_back_calls_for_lockerbie_public_inquiry.php

And the British Sleaze game continues with unelected Lord Mandelson's yet again getting 'accidentally' involved in inappropriate matter. Perhaps like the first two times this will result in his resignation, but given the remnants of the 'Socialist' Labour party have the morales of Alley cats perhaps not.

"Lord Mandelson, the Business Secreatry, is facing growing questions over his links with Saif Gaddafi, the son of Libyan leader Colonel Gadaffi"

"Saif Gadaffi, the son of the Libyan leader, who, it emerged last week, has met Lord Mandelson twice in the past four months.

At at least one of those meetings, the fate of Abdelbaset Ali Mohmed al Megrahi, the only man convicted of the Lockerbie bombing, was discussed. "

"It was only last year, after being once again caught out misleading the British electorate, that Lord Mandelson, who has twice been forced to resign from Government, publicly pledged to choose his friends more carefully. "

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/6073311/Lockerbie-bomber-release-Lord-Mandelson-his-wealthy-friends-and-the-Libyan-connection.html

More lies and deception for new Labour. If even arch Brit Nat Alan Cochrane can smell something rotten here it would appear their game is almost up and not before time.

Even the Scotsman has a very interesting take on Kenny MacAskill's stance in the name of compassion rather than cynical and underhand politics which are the mainstay of the British machine.

"History will record Megrahi's release as the right decision"

"They might find that it was the day that devolved Scotland came of age, when the significance of the powers devolved from Westminster came starkly into relief as a Scottish minister took a decision that resonated across the globe"

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/comment/History-will-record-Megrahi39s-release.5575342.jp

Yep Saltires may have been flown as part of inappropriate celebrations, but this is not nearly as bad has having the Union Jack burnt in hatred after the slaughter of 100's of thousands in an illegal war in Iraq in heart of the middle east. The more you study it the more vast the distance is of MacAskill's moral stance from the cynical British stance which basically eschews any morality or compassion - evidently is just business even with a terrorist sponsoring murderer such as Gadaffi.

From somebody who actually knows more than most on this subject.

Dr Jim Swire, Father of Flora age 23, one of 270 people killed at Lockerbie 21/12/88.

This is excerpts of the letter he wrote to Kenny MacAskill asking for compassionate release. Like Kenny MacAskill his plea is from the heart and devoid of the cynical posturing and ignorance of the facts of many on these forums. The full letter is in the link below.

"The prisoner transfer agreement (PTA), which is among the subjects we will raise with you today was born in what the media have come to refer to as ‘the deal in the desert’ between Prime Minister Blair and Colonel Gaddafi.

We, relatives of some of those who died aboard the Maid of the Seas in 1988 come from a deeper darker desert of more than 20 years duration: the desert of loss in which we have searched for truth and justice. During those 20 years, time and again, we have been denied an inquiry by a whole succession of English Prime Ministers. Almost the only light to shine into that darkness has been those aspects of the truth which we have gleaned from study of the evidence led at Zeist. You will find us make common cause for the continuation therefore of the current appeal as being the only currently available vehicle for discovering more of that truth we crave, and to which we have an unalienable right. "
.....
"But I am here simply as a father who is determined to find out who murdered his daughter and why they were not prevented from doing so. I have a right to know these things, but as an individual I have never sought revenge, for vengeance must remain in the hands of a far greater Power than you or I Sir.
Thus I have applauded the easing of the enmity between Libya and Britain, but I have also empathised with the fate of one man, now dying, and his family, whose continuing torturous separation serves no purpose in the administration of justice, beyond being a means of reducing the cries of outrage raised by those who set aside the precepts of human kindness.

Use of Compassionate Release(CR) would allow Baset home knowing that review of his case could continue. It would gloriously fulfil the Christian exhortation ‘love thine enemy’ for many I know regard Baset as such.

Use of CR would also mean that those innocent relatives who seek the truth and desperately hope therefore that the appeal can continue and reveal more of that truth would get their wish.

We or our descendents will be around to see how history judges the great decision which it falls upon you, Sir, to make.

I wish you wisdom, integrity and human kindness in making that weighty decision."

http://tinyurl.com/kt9qvx

Again an incomparable higher morale ground that many on these boards (Scotsman newspaper) do not even come close to.

Another wee blast from Traquair:

I wonder if the Scottish Parliament opposition parties will raise any issues beyond just partisan attacks on the SNP.

Here are a few valid ones that they must surely want to know the answers to ?

1. Why was Megrahi's appeal dropped ?
Megrahi's appeal to the Scottish Criminal Cases Review Commission in Sept 2003 and have 3 and half years of exhaustive research they concluded that an appeal was valid due to even the most basic dates of evidence being wrong and new evidence had not been presented amongst other items. Even with Megrahi dying the appeal could have continued posthumously so why was it dropped ? The appeal findings can be found here.

http://www.sccrc.org.uk/ViewFile.aspx?id=293

2. Why is a public inquiry being resisted even to the extend that Miliband has used a public interest immunity certificate that prevents disclosure to al-Megrahi's defence of this potentially crucial evidence ?

http://www.sundayherald.com/oped/opinion/display.var.2068681.0.miliband_has_made_lockerbie_appeal_a_mockery_of_justice.php

3. Why did unelected Lord Mandelson not only meet Gadaffi's son in the last couple weeks, but also discussed the Megrahi case ?

http://tinyurl.com/nw9mk9

4. Does Gordon Brown agree or disagree with the decision to release Megrahi on compassionate grounds ?

5. Why did Westminster, unlike the Americans, refuse to provide a submission as requested by Kenny MacAskill ?

6. What pressure did Westminster try to inject into these proceeding ? One letter has already surfaced which attempts to push for a release.

7. What would be the consequences of Megrahi dying as a Marytr on Scottish soil ?

These questions and more should be part of any real investigation here. Anything less is nothing less than Witch Hunt come Spanish Inquisition which will truly make a mockery of the Scottish Parliament.

More from Traquair, in the NBP comments:

Yawn ...... Yet more paranoid Brit Nat attacks. It is all getting rather boring. Of course with a former editor of the Scotsman admitting that the UK Government and intelligence services influenced coverage of Lockerbie there is even less reason to take this paper seriously. "Magnus Linklater, the editor of the Scotsman newspaper at the time of the Lockerbie investigation, has revealed that UK Government and intelligence services influenced coverage of the Lockerbie inquiry to implicate Iran and Syria. Linklater admitted that both the police and UK Government ministers directed the newspaper to concentrate their coverage on Iranian and Syrian links with the downing of Pan Am 103, the suspects initially favoured by the US and UK administrations. "This is not just conspiracy theory," Linklater said."
http://tinyurl.com/p76r2w

Very interesting that they have not focused nor likely even reported on this highly damaging attack on the basic rights of freedom of speech. But when you are in the full fervour of a Brit Nat persecution come Witch Hunt what matters the small manner of undermining one of the most basic aspects of a democracy. Of course only the most simple minded and naive buffoons would believe for a second that Lockerbie was the only media coverage that has come and no doubt still comes under the influence of the UK Government and intelligence services. Welcome to the Brit Nat police state, they must be especially proud of the way the Scotsman is carrying out it's orders, I suspect a few unelected Lordships and Orders of the British Empire are in the post.

Fifi la Bonbon
"Anyway, the mass murderer is out and free to carry on his job as a propagandist and secret service official for the Gadaffi dictatorship regime."
I understand that the mass murderer that is Gadaffi is not only free, but has never been even brought to trial and now his new bestest pals are Brown, Blair & Mandy. So unprincipled politicians sucking up to a cold blooded murderer.
Any problem with that all Fifi ?

Now with Megrahi he has killed at most 279 people assuming he is guilty and there is reasonable doubt there which is why an appeal was allowed since there were at least 6 serious concerns about a miscarriage of justice. In any case let's go with the assumption he is guilty which implies Gadaffi is guilty of at least 279 murders from just one of his pieces of terrorist barbarism. Now how many 1000's did he really kill, and why no condemnation from the leaders of this supposed British democracy ?
"the IRA's acquisition of arms through Libya in the 1980s helped transform the organisation into one that could fight a devastating and sustained campaign"
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/1482426.stm

"Libya, and Yemen serve as the primary suppliers of weapons to Palestinian terrorists in the Gaza Strip" http://www.weaponsurvey.com/salw.htm
One would have thought the Northern Irish Orange British men will be particularly outraged and disgusted that their family and friends were blown up for decades throughout the Troubles and one of the masterminds behind in the form of Gadaffi is the bestest friends with British Brown. By the day MacAskill's principled stance stands like a beacon of light compared with the cess-pit in which the like of Brown & Mandelson dwell in unison with one of the most foul and despicable criminals of modern history. The hypocrisy and lack of any principals here from the leaders of the Brit Nats is astounding.

Thought I would just check in and see how the debate is devolving however sadly I see the Brit Nat hypocrisy is continuing unabated like some shark feeding frenzy. They continue to bay for blood from Kenny MacAskill who legally released a prisoner dying from cancer based on compassion and not politics. He had an opportunity here to screw Brown and the British royally by destroying all of their trade agreement with Libya, but instead put what was right above petty partisan politics. Yet there is not a word about the mass murderer Gadaffi who is hail & hearty and has killed many thousands more via his sponsorship of the IRA, PLO and of course the PAN-AM bombing. Worse than that the Brit Nats appear to see no issue with their elected leader Brown cravenly begging and licking the boots of this mass-murderer to try and make a few trade deals. The degree of hypocrisy here just escalates massively by the day. In the case of the Brit Nats never was truer the Burn's saying "O wad some Power the gift tae gie us To see oursels as ithers see us". At this point even I am starting to feel pity for the Brit Nats, and that is saying something.

A little more of a bio on British Brown's best new friend.
"A documentary about gaddafi's atrocities and heinous crimes committed in Libya and abroad. He is a bloody terrorist and a dictator ruling Libya since he confiscated power through a coup in 1969. He liquidated all his opponents without trials and imprisoned any one who criticized him. He hung people in public squares and stadiums and broadcasted their hanging on TV in the holy month of Ramadan. He sent his death squads of revolutionary committees to kill Libyans abroad for just running away from his regime or voicing their opinions against it. He ordered the killing of 1200 political prisoners in abusleem prison uprising demanding fair trials and improvement in their miserable living conditions. He committed international terrorist activity by bombing planes over Lockerbie Scotland and Niger desert and engaging in wars against his neighbouring countries, not to mention supporting terrorist groups worldwide (IRA, PLO etc) and plotting to assassinate foreign leaders".
http://www.stopqaddafi.org/index.php?option=com_seyret&Itemid=26

The Brit Nats must be so proud to be getting trade deals done with this devil in their name. It is over 20 years since Lockerbie why are the Brit Nats not baying for blood of this mass murderer and have not done so at any point from then and until now they still remain silence. They have only found some supposed self-righteous position now that they are able to attack the SNP. They really need to look at themselves as to what they have become.

For usaCameron, Washingtonville, NY
It may have escaped your attention but Scotland is a major oil producer in Europe and we are sitting on up twice as much oil that has already been taken and squandered by England over the last several decades.
"North Sea oil 'will last for another half century'"
http://tinyurl.com/6ml3np
"North Sea could see second oil boom due to huge unexplored reserves"
http://tinyurl.com/5rxnxd
"North Sea oil reserves could be a fifth higher"
http://tinyurl.com/4c6zp3
"North Sea oil 'remains untapped'"
http://tinyurl.com/6q9fjp
"North Sea 'far from scraping bottom of oil barrel'"
http://tinyurl.com/3ggla2
"North Sea oil 'remains untapped'"
http://tinyurl.com/4m669l
"Industry leaders say North Sea oil is far from gone"
http://tinyurl.com/5ja2ck

To suggest that Scotland has done a deal for Oil is frankly imbecile and naive beyond belief. Now for England that has virtually no oil of it's own you may be on to something, but to assume that Scotland would do a deal to help out Brown seal his backroom British oil deals with Gadaffi is straight out of the Twilight Zone and shows not even a basic grasp on the politics of this divided kingdom.

For usaCameron, Washingtonville, NY
Again sir I refer you to the fact that England is desperate for Oil whilst Scotland is not. The thought of the Scottish SNP Government and Westminster Goverments working together is laughable, they mutually loath and distrust each other to a massive degree, and in the case of the Scottish Government for very good reason with this Union of unequals completely controlled my a massively centralized London power base. I agree with you that there are oil deals being worked out by the British (aka code for England), but you are incorrect that Scotland and England are working together on this. Scotland has no incentive, not even more oil would help us - England already takes all of the revenues of Scottish oil and no doubt any more oil they manage to get their hands on by whatever manipulative, immoral and underhand techniques they can muster you can be assured will also flow fully and exclusively to London. Now if you are aware of some bribe that makes it worth Scotland's while here then let it be know - perhaps some Libyan/British join oil operation is about to be HQ'ed in Scotland with massive jobs and revenues- I think not. There is no gain to Scotland out of this , it is merely England's blood thirst for oil, and Scotland is being used as a pawn in this. We are not party to the beneath contempt behaviour of the likes of Brown & Mandelson who have become the newest best friends of mass murderer Gadaffi. If you can think of what benefit Scotland specifically gets out of this to make it worth our while to do a deal with the likes of Brown I would love to hear it.

"Traquìr? How do we tell our people this?"

I think we need to buy a newspaper, I see the Scotsman is for sale :)
Additionally with the internet, word of mouth the truth is spreading and the lies of the Brit Nats are becoming more and more farcical few but the brain dead and red rosette monkeys can fail to see through them. We also need to broaden the support for independence for our nation. The SNP is only one way of pushing independence and they like any political party will make their own mistakes. We need to steer and broaden the debate here, the SNP is just a means to and end and a transient one at that. Post independence it will dissolve into its constituent parts. What we need is a broad a growing coalition that supports independence - currently there are a wide number already and we should encourage all of these to grow alongside rather than against the SNP e.g. Scottish Enterprise Party, Scottish Socialist Party, Solidarity, Scottish Democratic Alliance, Scottish Greens, Scottish Independence Convention. We also need to broaden out to those that significantly want to put Scotland first via means like Full Fiscal Autonomy which can be useful stepping stones rather than the pebbles over by the likes of Calman. The SNP themselves need to broaden the appeal to others and make clear that the overriding issue here is full control of our own nation with or with out the SNP.

We need to double up our efforts also since we know we have a biased and one sided media war against us. The article from Magnus Linklater is timely reminder of what we are up against.

"Magnus Linklater, the editor of the Scotsman newspaper at the time of the Lockerbie investigation, has revealed that UK Government and intelligence services influenced covLinklater admitted that both the police and UK Government ministers directed the newspaper to concentrate their coverage on Iranian and Syrian links with the downing of Pan Am 103, the suspects initially favoured by the US and UK administrations. "This is not just conspiracy theory," Linklater said."
http://tinyurl.com/p76r2w

Ultimately what will win independence is that Scotland is being put first and foremost where it belongs and in parallel to this the England dominated Union is becoming increasingly indefensible, even the Tories are doubting it is worth saving. "recent survey of Tory candidates, 46 per cent say they would not be ‘uncomfortable about Scotland becoming independent’."